The Self in orthodox buddhism

Hi

Some people say that the Buddha denied the existence of an eternal autonomous substantial Self, but that the Buddha did not deny the existence of an impermanent relative conventional Self. For these people, the Buddha does not go against the idea that our relative identity is our human body and human mind, he would only reject the eternal autonomous substantial Self.

Except that when I read sutta of the Pali Canon, it is often said:
« the 5 aggregates are not the “I”, the tongue and the consciousness of taste are not the “I”, the body and the consciousness of touch are not the “I” ».
So I don’t get the impression that the Buddha was only rejecting an eternal autonomous substantial self, but ALSO the impermanent relative conventional self.
In fact, I think that although the Buddha totally rejects the idea of a “self”, he does accept the existence of individual minds undergoing rebirths. But we can’t call these individual minds “I”, even conventionally speaking. Is this correct? I wish to align myself with the orthodox Theravada position.

What do you think about this?

Also, I tend to meditate on the fact that I am neither a permanent autonomous substantial Self, nor an impermanent relative conventional Self. Is that dangerous? I should only meditate on the absence of a permanent autonomous substantial Self?

Thanks in advance.

May all beings reach the causelessness.

Good questions!
Here is the orthodox position:
Visuddhimagga XVIII 31

Therefore, just as a marionette is void, soulless and without curiosity, and
while it walks and stands merely through the combination of strings and wood,
[595] yet it seems as if it had curiosity and interestedness, so too, this mentality-materiality
is void, soulless and without curiosity, and while it walks and stands
merely through the combination of the two together, yet it seems as if it had
curiosity and interestedness. This is how it should be regarded. Hence the
Ancients said:
The mental and material are really here,
But here there is no human being to be found,
For it is void and merely fashioned like a doll—
Just suffering piled up like grass and sticks.

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Thank you!

As I understand it, the orthodox Theravada position is to deny the substantial AND conventional Self.

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Conventional self … If you mean it as just daily conversation expression, then it is acceptable as per Dhamma.

Even Lord Buddha referred Himself as “Tathagata”. It is just for conversation purpose.

But the concept/belief of Self is rejected, as per what Robertk posted.

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